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FaeryLady's Avatar

FaeryLady Live long and eat Pudding

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If you ask him, you pay. You never never never break a date because AFTER you ask, you don't have the cash to pay for it. (Exceptions: house burns down, doc just told you that you have terminal cancer, etc.) Suck it up & get out the credit card for the evening. You knew your son's BD & the party were close together.


If YOU decided you needed a hotel room because you plan to drink too much, or maybe you told the date YOU have a hotel room for the night and that's not where your relationship is.... well, that's causing a different problem.


Frankly, I think your expectations were out of line. Flip it - if he'd asked you, then broke the date because he needed to spend the $ on his daughter's BD-- how would you react?
I live check to check and don't have Credit Cards. And if the situation were reversed (I have been in that situation before) I would offer to pay because I understand about kids and money. That is part of the reason for my feelings.
- November 25th, 2008, 08:28 am
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FaeryLady Live long and eat Pudding

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Lindac7 wrote :

The answer is simple. Forget the hotel room, drink responsibly (or better yet, not at all), and drive back responsibly so a hotel room is not necessary. By approaching the problem that way, it shouldn't cost you or him anything at all to go (except for gasoline).


Just bite the bullet and do what is necessary to get what you want. If you want to go to the party THAT badly, it's either do this, or charge the hotel room and pay for it yourself.
Regardless of drinking, I live 2 hours away. My date lives in the area but not on the way home. I would have to drive home alone and Idon't want that drive at midnight or later. He has commitments in the morning and staying at his house is not an option.
- November 25th, 2008, 08:35 am
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Let's put it this way, I like it when a man pays and I'll be the first to admit it. But you know what? I pay for dates too! I'm currently seeing someone who always steps up to pay and it's greatly appreciated but it's not like I need that or am asking for that. That's just the way that he is. I feel if someone initiates the get together, they pay. If you're there, either of you want something, it's nice to offer to pay with the knowledge that if the other person doesn't offer, don't sweat it. Don't wait for them to pay for you and please don't try to read their mind or have them try to read yours. That's what comminication is for. If you want or need the other person to help pay for something, speak up! I also think it depends on how someone was raised, how they see themselves and in the current financial climate we're in, how much you or they can afford. A lot of people go dutch and think nothing of it.

- November 25th, 2008, 10:26 am
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If this is about Chivalry, I just want to say that with girls my age it seems that they all say or think they want Chivalry (on all levels) but when it comes down to it, they are turned off by it and end up dating a jerk AGAIN, sometimes it almost seems like Chivalry is looked at as a bad thing with ppl my age.
- November 25th, 2008, 05:35 pm
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FaeryLady Live long and eat Pudding

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I thank you all for your comments and feedback. Some of you have given me real reason to think and consider my position. I believe I have found a solution.
- November 26th, 2008, 08:09 am
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dnnmllr "Steady my feet in accord with your promise, Let not iniquity lead me"...

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I try to read this in different ways, but what it comes out to is about the same thing:

"I wanted to go to my company party. I offered to pay, things were okay and we were going. Then I found out I couldn't pay. He didn't offer to help. I can't have what I want. Wwaaaahhhhh!"


Seriously. It sounds like you're throwing a tantrum because you found out you can't pay for it and want to blame him because he won't foot the bill. I think it's quite nervy of you to get mad at him and say he's not being chivalrous because he's not doing what you want -- and that's what it looks like over and over. You're just mad because he didn't read your mind and do what you wanted.


Then you blame the men because we're not seeing it your way -- but you also find out that there's at least one woman who doesn't see it your way. It looks like it's time to come to terms with this: He did nothing wrong and you have no grounds to blame him for not being chivalrous.


Now I'm going to write something I doubt you want to hear: There are two sides to chivalry. Yes, there's what men do, but there's the reverse, and that's how women receive it or deal with it. Expecting him to be chivalrous and getting upset when he doesn't do what you want is not chivalrous at all on your end. To do what you've done is to take advantage of chivalry, and that steps outside that system. It's quite possible he realized you were hinting, in some vague way, that he should pay and that could very well be the reason he didn't offer.


If I walk a lady to my car, I open the door for her, help her in (which often helps, since I usually drive a 2 seater that's low to the ground) and help her find the seatbelt before I shut the door for her. I do that because I was raised by a Virginia Gentleman to be a Virginia Gentleman. Now if I walk her to the car and she walks quickly and gets in front of me, then stands there, tapping her foot, waiting for me to open the door and looks at me, without saying anything, to communicate that it is now my job to open the door for her, that is just plain rude and is taking advantage of my tendancy to be chivalrous. It's wrong of her to do that and I have two responses I can quickly think of: Open the door with enough grace that she realizes she's being ungraceful and ungrateful, or just say, "Open it yourself. You've got two hands."


You've done about the same thing: you've rushed to the door and are expecting it to be opened for you. By expecting him to pay, you have taken away the opportunity for him to be chivalrous. You've turned it into his responsibility and that is using him. It's wrong. What makes it worse is that this involves money -- you are essentially using chivalry as an excuse to expect financial help from him. He is doing you a favor by letting you remain financially self-sufficient.


You didn't get what you wanted, you're not going to get it, and I truly feel sorry for this guy who is being judged because he essentially isn't doing what you want. There's no nice way to say this, but I think you're acting like a spoiled child. You offered to pay, so we should think you're wonderful, but now you don't get what you want, so we should see you as wounded. That's what it looks like and the more you explain it, the more it looks like that.


I know this sounds harsh, but I really don't do well sugar-coating my thoughts, it just never sounds sincere. I'm not saying you're a bad person, but I think you've let what you want in this situation blind you into being manipulative and not putting your best foot forward.
....."Then you blame the men because we're not seeing it your way -- but you also find out that there's at least one woman who doesn't see it your way. It looks like it's time to come to terms with this: He did nothing wrong and you have no grounds to blame him for not being chivalrous.".....


- November 26th, 2008, 08:28 am
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I have been following this thread for a bit because i had a woman who would do this sort of thing to me, and while I know that the manipulation isn't intentional here and wasn't intentional in my case, i still viewed it as manipulation.

Here is the thing, I HATE being manipulated with a passion. i have a pretty healthy ego, and when i say healthy, i mean not arrogant, i mean healthy. I know who I am and what i want out of life. I am not a pushover and I don't suck up. I have enough dignity and self respect to walk away when I am being toyed with. So you can understand where I am coming from when I say i HATE being manipulated. Not only that but i am direct and blunt to a fault. I don't sugar coat things and If i want something I ask or say so. Maybe this is my fault but I expect other people to do the same.

In that guys position, I would have felt like i was being manipulated ether way and that's not necessarily your fault, thats just how some guys roll. I think had you come out and said, "hey, i have a great idea, lets go to my office party. Thing is, im a little short on the cash, can you help me out? If not its cool, we can do something else." Had you started out with that, or explained it to him that way, it probably wouldn't have been a big deal at all.

I refuse to become the mind reader who guesses what women are thinking and tries to anticipate their needs. Guys are not dumb, we know when something is up and if we cant guess right off the bat we generally have a pretty good idea about what is going on but are waiting till you say something to the affect of, "hey, i need a little help"

- November 26th, 2008, 11:12 am
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FaeryLady Live long and eat Pudding

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Kade wrote :

I have been following this thread for a bit because i had a woman who would do this sort of thing to me, and while I know that the manipulation isn't intentional here and wasn't intentional in my case, i still viewed it as manipulation. Here is the thing, I HATE being manipulated with a passion. i have a pretty healthy ego, and when i say healthy, i mean not arrogant, i mean healthy. I know who I am and what i want out of life. I am not a pushover and I don't suck up. I have enough dignity and self respect to walk away when I am being toyed with. So you can understand where I am coming from when I say i HATE being manipulated. Not only that but i am direct and blunt to a fault. I don't sugar coat things and If i want something I ask or say so. Maybe this is my fault but I expect other people to do the same. In that guys position, I would have felt like i was being manipulated ether way and that's not necessarily your fault, thats just how some guys roll. I think had you come out and said, "hey, i have a great idea, lets go to my office party. Thing is, im a little short on the cash, can you help me out? If not its cool, we can do something else." Had you started out with that, or explained it to him that way, it probably wouldn't have been a big deal at all. I refuse to become the mind reader who guesses what women are thinking and tries to anticipate their needs. Guys are not dumb, we know when something is up and if we cant guess right off the bat we generally have a pretty good idea about what is going on but are waiting till you say something to the affect of, "hey, i need a little help"
It was not immediately aware that I could not afford the night. When I found out I did approach him with my situation. I am very much like you and I am very blunt and upfront with who I am and what I want. His solution was for me to find other areas that I could cut back so I could afford the night.


I am don't blame him for anything and I am not mad at him. I know that it was within his right to allow me to pay for the evening, and I was prepared to do so. It was not my intention to manipulate him in any way. But I still can't help but feel disappointed that he did not offer to help.
- November 26th, 2008, 11:46 am
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FaeryLady wrote :




I am don't blame him for anything and I am not mad at him. I know that it was within his right to allow me to pay for the evening, and I was prepared to do so. It was not my intention to manipulate him in any way. But I still can't help but feel disappointed that he did not offer to help.
I think he should be disappointed that you had unreasonable expectations of him.


You're expecting him to be Santa Claus, not a chivalrous man.


The bad news is Mick is right and you can't always get what you want and it's selfish to blame others for that.
- November 26th, 2008, 11:51 am
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you want this, and you want that. you don't want this, and that is not an option. Well, if you don't feel that you can drive home late, drunk or sober, and leaving at a reasonable time is not an option for you....and you can't afford the alternatives: I guess you have some right to be perturbed. Because who ever this guy is ought to know what he is dealing with by now.
- November 26th, 2008, 12:03 pm
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