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D_Lion wrote :
"Thousands of dollars" is every data point I have, and all posts which have disclosed this value here.

I know that national-scope data is weighted toward poor people, but that is not germane to myself and most of the people posting here.

The figures cited by other posters as percent of income awarded, amount to thousounds per month to me, and likely to most of us. Thus, those are the values which are germane to our discussion.
Well, first of all, thousands of dollars a month is not every data point you have, because I provided you with the census data on this matter, which reveals that the median annual child support payment assessed it about $4000, or a bit under $350/month. You can try to rationalize ignoring that data, but the excuse of ignorance to it no longer holds up.

Regarding your specific situation, I have repeatedly pointed to you to online calculators for child support so that you could calculate what the payment would look like in your case. As far as I can tell, you have not taken advantage of that resource, preferring to make assumptions about what those payments would be in your case.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:30 pm
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neardc neardc is offline
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Well, good luck to you if you hope to make the equivalent of over half a million a year in current dollars. I don't know anyone who does, no matter what their level of education (Phd, MD, etc.) or work experience (perhaps an attorney or two?). I realize that some people do make this much, but they are rare even in high cost regions of the country. That is just reality. There is nothing at all wrong with aspiring to being wealthy, but it's disingenuous to suggest that it's necessary for survival or to live a good life.

(I also question how you are calculating equivalence with your father, but I won't get into that here... )
- November 6th, 2009, 04:33 pm
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D_Lion D_Lion is offline
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neardc wrote :
(I also question how you are calculating equivalence with your father, but I won't get into that here... )

Cost of housing, the largest expense for most people.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:37 pm
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There's nothing wrong with wanting a high standard of living....however, you seriously undercut yourself when you act like you are inherently entitled to such a standard of living regardless of other obligations, and your statements about being on the brink of homelessness are laughable. You do not *have* to live in a 3 bedroom house, much less live in one by yourself as it sounds like you do. In fact, if you're living in a house alone, you're spending hundreds of dollars a month (in the form of forgone rent) for the privilege of having such a large amount of space to yourself. Yes, we all need food, clothing, and shelter to survive. That doesn't mean that my food, clothing, and housing expenses are all "survival necessities" regardless of the quality of those items.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:38 pm
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D_Lion wrote :
I consider it a reasonable expectation that I, with comparable skills and work ethic, replicate my father's standard of living (ought to be more considering a generation of productivity growth.)

Average data which include the kind of people who don't bother showing up for work on time, are not germane - and you know it.
Your father's standard of living did not include internet, microwave ovens, big screen TVs, cell phones, and lots of other things that are considered normal parts of the standard of living today. Back then (at least in my father's age) few people had health insurance, and certainly not dental insurance. Most houses did not have dishwashers, and if a family owned a car at all, it was only one, not one for each driver.

All things considered, you probably are living at a higher standard of living than your father did. Considering ONLY the cost of housing is not a true reflection of the standard of living.

Also, a lot of your standard of living is dependent on where you choose to live. You live in a very expensive part of the country. From the generalities you've given, I suspect my income is very close to yours. I live in a $190,000 suburban house ( 3 bedrooms, 3 baths, 2000 SF, 2 car garage) in an excellent school district, amongst educated neighbors. I support 3 people on my salary, plus pay my mortgage and all other expenses... including health insurance for my kids.

My folks' house was bigger and nicer than mine, but all things considered I think my standard of living is equal to or better than what they had. I would not be able to replicate this standard of living if I were to choose to live where you do.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:39 pm
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D_Lion D_Lion is offline
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I do if those are the only houses on the market, which they are where I live.

In any case, less costly housing (in even less appropriate neighborhoods) is not occupied by single persons or widows as one might assume, but by illegal immigrants living (illegally) several families / house, parking six cars on the lawn, etc.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:42 pm
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D_Lion wrote :
I do if those are the only houses on the market, which they are where I live.

In any case, less costly housing (in even less appropriate neighborhoods) is not occupied by single persons or widows as one might assume, but by illegal immigrants living (illegally) several families / house, parking six cars on the lawn, etc.
Stats to back this up, please.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:45 pm
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D_Lion D_Lion is offline
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That is a good post, but (and it will be full of very big buts) …

Big TV does not cost any more than small TV did 20 years ago, in real terms (and $500 TV every 15 years is so meaningless compared to five-figure annual property tax) – but you know that.

Cell phone (only) is less than he paid for POTS – but you know that. And $244 / year mobile phone is far less than five-figure property tax (at 7.1% CAGR in NJ.) – but you know that.

I am confident (not having the data though) my father had far better health cover than employers offer today. Not to mention the ridiculous 6%+ CAGR heath inflation – but you know that.

I don’t choose where I live, my employer does (I would move in an instant if I could.)

And we haven’t even begun to talk about longer work weeks for lesser security, no pension, etc – but you know that.

Fact is, men have lost real wages in the US. Full stop.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:52 pm
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D_Lion D_Lion is offline
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Faira wrote :
Stats to back this up, please.

Eyes, co-workers, local newspaper.
- November 6th, 2009, 04:53 pm
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saulgoode saulgoode is offline
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neardc wrote :
Dangit! Got modded... Post to appear here... eventually...

In the meantime, here is a link to a site that seems to do a good job of explaining these issues: Fort Lauderdale Divorce Attorney :: Articles & FAQs :: North Lauderdale Family Law Lawyer

Dude (ette), aren't you a MODERATOR!

How'd you get mod'd?

- Saul
- November 6th, 2009, 04:54 pm
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